“The Knicks were between a rock and a hard place, and neither Immanuel Quickley nor RJ Barrett represented an escape from that conundrum.” There’s always a line like this in every JMac written piece that so incisively articulates the crux of a complicated dynamic. That’s one of the reasons this wonderful community has cohered around your content, and why I am so pleased to be part of it. So great to have KFS for the bad times and the good, and all the wobbly feels in between.
Man, Charles...that hit me in the feels right there. I do what I do PURELY to make someone, anyone have that sort of reaction to something I write. Cannot thank you enough for taking the time to share your sentiments.
The trade is the trade. From a journalism perspective this is first class analysis, not the off-the-cuff drivel so many produce. And you did it with so much else going on. Spectacular
Dec 30, 2023·edited Dec 30, 2023Liked by Jonathan Macri
As always, extremely well written and thought out!
As a big fan of both IQ and Rj, I am very sad that the Magic game was the last time we will see them in a Knicks uniform. However on the flip side, I am happy that IQ is going to finally get to shine in an expanded role that he fully deserves, and, I believe that Rj has a chance of becoming a good player on the Raptors. I wish both of them good luck!
But since I am sentimental, I was wondering if could you maybe write a piece looking back at the good moments that Rj and IQ brought us. As you noted, us fans have created deep connections to these guys and its hard to see them moved on from so abruptly. They are both key reasons as to why this organization is where it is today and they had many great moments in the uniform. Anytime IQ stepped on the court was a true joy, and he is one of the most fun players to watch in the entire league. And with Rj, he had his fair share of incredible moments as well, like in the playoffs last year (where he impacted winning in a positive/meaningful way ;))). It would be nice to provide some “closure” on this front.
This all said, I am a fan of this move and have a lot of other thoughts that I will save for another newsletter!
OG is such a perfect fit for the Knicks. I can’t wait to see it on the floor. I just wish Mitch could get back healthy this year - we would have one of the most imposing defenses in the league. I will always love RJ and IQ, but to me the writing was on the wall with them since the Donovan Mitchell trade talks. You can agree or disagree with the front office’s assessment, but it is what it is. Of course, we’re still in the position of waiting for the next move once again, but at least this version of the roster makes sense again. There’s a clear upgrade potential at SG (and/or possibly at center?)... but at least the pieces we have here now make sense together. Weird day. Thank you for helping to bring us back to respectability and for all the memories, IQ and RJ. 💙🧡
Wonderful piece, Jon. Thanks to the entire KFS team for all the great emergency content today!
The emotional aspect is so, so tough for me. Probably the toughest of any trade in recent memory. I’ve loved RJ since “Yo! I’m a Knick” and Quickley since he burst on to the scene. I have not experienced much winning in my time as a Knicks fan. RJ and IQ were parts of two of the most fun seasons I’ve seen. I couldn’t help but get attached to them and I would have killed for it to work out here and have them be part of the championship core
At the same time, I’m the same one who recently started advocating to upgrade the wing spot so we don’t waste Jalen and Julius’s primes. This trade accomplishes that and I’m excited to see OG on the team and what comes next. I think it’s good the front office is done waiting around. We have two All-NBA level guys to build around. Go for it!
For me, I saw the championship years where it was easy to root for a great team that was likable. Same for the near miss teams that broke their heart against the wall of the Bulls (and some others...😤).
And then there have been long wastelands of terrible and unlikeable players representing the Knicks. I waited for years for players who were gifted and likable as human beings. IQ met that standard in spades.
And so now I grieve for what might have been. I doubt I will be around for a real championship team since those seem to depend upon generational players and having that guy is so random. But maybe.
It is going to take a while to get over losing this player. I suppose I will since I have had to get over a lot worse than basketball over the years entering a seventh decade.
I tried Peter, and I know how passionate you are about Quickley, and I do not blame you for a moment. My thought / hope is that this gets them closer to that fabled, elusive promised land, but reasonable minds can disagree. We shall see.
You did warn me for a couple of years. Thanks for your incredible insights and compassion. What you do here really is incredible.
I find it interesting that you write an article detailing the issues of RJ and he is gone in a couple of days. Seems like you did send it to Brunson. 😂
And while I have heard that certain members of the org have read this newsletter in the past, I would never be so bold as to suggest it had any impact on this move!
I am not 90/10 or 50/50 for this trade. I am 100/0 in favor.
The Knicks needed more size and to reduce the logjam at SG (too many players for the minutes there). Giving up Barrett, who's been eviscerated here of late, should not be met with grief of any kind. Quickley would've been a FO decision--it was apparent he was going to be moved. Annunoby is a great fit and I'm trusting/hoping that Leon Rose will re-sign him.
So yes, I'm all in. If ultimately successful, it may someday somewhat be thought of as comparable to the Cazzie Russell (high-scoring sixth man) for Jerry Lucas (PF/center and a better roster fit).
As for any presumed trade for Donovan Mitchell, I'm a no. Reason: lack of defense/size at the backcourt for approx. 30 minutes a game. Witness previous Knick high-scoring/no-defense duos from the past: Haywood/McAdoo; Anthony/Stoudamire; Fournier/Walker. Frequent final scores like 133-127 does not make for a champioship-caliber team.
I'm with you - for as much as I understand *how* they could wind up losers in this trade, I don't see *ANY* way they could have passed it up given all of the factors at play. And FTM at least, I'm also a no on Mitchell, but I need to dwell on that some more.
I feel that this was more about IQ than RJ. The Knicks weren’t going to be able to pay IQ what he thought he deserved and keep him as a sixth man. He had to get starters minutes in order to justify a significant payday,and that wasn’t happening with Brunson as the lead guard. RJ will be a better version of himself, he’ll have more freedom to operate. Now we get OG and Precious both of whom can play small ball 5 if needed. Grimes should get more minutes too now that the FO cleared some of the logjam of guards. We still need a bonafide shooter, so let’s see if Fournier gets moved too.
I would've loved this trade if I knew another piece was coming in IQ wasn't part of it. I have to now retire my IQ statue to knick oblivion. everything you say analytically is correct Johnathan, but it still hurts. I really had hoped that Barrett after the summer with the Canadian team would make him worth every penny and it's just too much inconsistency as the IQ I can see him running for Toronto and scoring 25 to 30 points a night. On my wish list of Brunson and him together like Monroe and Fraser. I guess I have to live with the idea that it'll never happen. Happy new year.
I hear you and feel you Mike. I think IQ is going to thrive in Toronto. But I also don't think him and Brunson was ever tenable on a title team. Could be wrong about that. I wonder if we'll ever find out for sure.
Don't know if my original went through on this, but just in case. I just love this kid he brought it all onto the court with such spontaneity and creativity. Who knows if they would've been a good tandem, but again, my mindset is still historical with Frazier and Monroe, where everyone said they wouldn't be enough balls. Thank you for your wonderful work and wishing you and your family a happy healthy new year. Addition by subtraction should work especially if they aren't finished yet which I don't think they are. There is no way in nowhere that they don't sign Adanobe to extension. Just like Scott Boras wasn't talked to about an extension with soto before the trade.
I don’t know how I feel about this deal, and I probably will not until they bring in a star-level player to replace Quickley’s ability to shoot, create and pass. And it won’t be easy. Of the the five players traded, Quickley has the highest upside and the best chance at becoming an all-star. Trading RJ on the other hand makes great sense. RJ just could not accept that he’s not a star, and could never learn to defer to Brunson or Randle.
OG is definitely a big upgrade in the front court. He’s a good shooter, 37% from 3 land and 40% when shooting corner threes. And obviously, he is a tremendous defender. But he cannot create his own shot and I hope he doesn’t decide he’s a superstar and gun away.
To me, this deal is incomplete. They now desperately need a creative scorer. Until then, during crunch time, Brunson will have five guys guarding him (an exaggeration but point made) and the Knicks will need to depend upon Donte or Grimes to relieve the pressure on Brunson. This is going to be an issue. Until a deal comes along for an efficient scorer, I think the Knicks have taken a step backwards.
Boy, I’d be throwing a party if they traded Grimes in this deal and not RJ.
I think it's VERY fair to mark this as an incomplete for right now. And I also think there's a good chance IQ winds up being the best player in the deal. But I'm also in favor. We'll see
Dec 31, 2023·edited Dec 31, 2023Liked by Jonathan Macri
Jon, I absolutely adore you & KFS & everything you've done here, but I feel like I have to say: Still talking about RJ's mythical upside not even a single day after writing the "Rowan Reckoning" article just feels crazy!
I guess that's sports. We believe in our guys and that they'll eventually reach the tantalizing upside they've shown us. But as your article last week stated:
- RJ is about to cross the 10,000 minute threshold, making him the 182nd player to cross that level. He's the 181st best player in terms of win shares over that time.
- RJ has the SAME WS/48 as FRANKIE SMOKES!!!
I've quoted the stat about Frankie Smokes to my friends all day when they've moaned & cried about losing RJ and the "upside". As desperately as I wanted RJ to be our savior, as much as I cheered when he hit that OT 3 against Boston, as proud as I was when we drafted him and he was so happy to be a Knick, he's just not that dude. He's more Evan Turner than Kawhi Leonard and that's a sad truth, but it is a truth. I wish him the best in Toronto & I hope being back on Maple soil helps him reach his upside. But it wasn't happening here.
As for IQ, we can absolutely debate the merits & potential upside that's there, but I also think we pretty much know who that dude is too. The league has had some incredible 6th men over the decades like Sweet Lou, JR, Jamal, etc., and the one thing they all have in common is that they bounced around to new teams every few years as that role is, simply, replaceable. IQ was my favorite Knick over the last few years, and it hurts to see him go -- but that was always his role.
I don't know if OG will help us reach our goals. But I do think I know, based on what we've seen over the last ~100 basketball games and your analysis along the way, that this team had reached its ceiling. It's time for something new, and as you said above we know have another piece that every team in the league would want on their team. Count me in.
Go Knicks & thank you Jon & team for the incredible work that is KFS.
Thanks for the thoughtful comment Nick! You know how I role: I always want to acknowledge all sides to any discussion topic even if I may not agree with them. Personally, I've been out on RJ for far longer than I've let on here. But at the same time, would it *shock* me if he put it all together at some point? Honestly no. In any case, HNY and LGK!
Great article Jon, and it was cathartic for me, as always. My brother, who is RJ's #1 fan, called me as soon as the news and the dejection in his voice was obvious. I had him on speaker and my wife thought something much more serious had happened. But that's fandom, because for us, it did. Still, I am comforted by the fact that Leon did RJ right by sending him home. He deserves that, for both his play and for the person that he is. I will follow his career, and Quick's closely as they made our team a team. I have to think giving Quick up in the deal was difficult, but this also tells me more is coming. And when it does, and when we win a championship, then we will know for certain it was the right move. But, much like letting go the girl you love deeply, even though it hurts and there may be dark days ahead, you're certain you'll find your soul mate because of it. As a fan, that's how I feel about the deal.
Thanks so much Brian, and please give your brother my best. It takes a real one to have stuck with RJ through thick and thin, and I feel for his biggest supporters probably more than Quick's tbh, because at least IQ has made it easy on his biggest fans.
Obviously what happens on the floor will decide whether this trade is a success or a failure, but in this moment, I don’t see how this is anything but a pretty significant W. We got a guy who, according to everything I read, was coveted league-wide, 1.5 additional rotation pieces (hopefully Deuce gets first crack over Flynn), and our roster is suddenly much more versatile and dynamic. We can go big or small; we can finally play 5-out; we traded two guys who need the ball and didn’t truly complement Brunson/Randle skill-wise and brought back a 26-year-old All-Defender who does (plus Precious, who I think is much more than a throw-in) -- I’m sad to see our guys go - I truly liked both of them - but I’m really f***ing excited to see how this comes together over the next twenty-plus games.
(I didn’t even mention that the only pick we gave up was a second!! That’s insane)
“The Knicks were between a rock and a hard place, and neither Immanuel Quickley nor RJ Barrett represented an escape from that conundrum.” There’s always a line like this in every JMac written piece that so incisively articulates the crux of a complicated dynamic. That’s one of the reasons this wonderful community has cohered around your content, and why I am so pleased to be part of it. So great to have KFS for the bad times and the good, and all the wobbly feels in between.
Man, Charles...that hit me in the feels right there. I do what I do PURELY to make someone, anyone have that sort of reaction to something I write. Cannot thank you enough for taking the time to share your sentiments.
The trade is the trade. From a journalism perspective this is first class analysis, not the off-the-cuff drivel so many produce. And you did it with so much else going on. Spectacular
Ray, you continue to be my inspiration. Thank you for the words sir. Will never agree with your praise, but I do appreciate it.
As always, extremely well written and thought out!
As a big fan of both IQ and Rj, I am very sad that the Magic game was the last time we will see them in a Knicks uniform. However on the flip side, I am happy that IQ is going to finally get to shine in an expanded role that he fully deserves, and, I believe that Rj has a chance of becoming a good player on the Raptors. I wish both of them good luck!
But since I am sentimental, I was wondering if could you maybe write a piece looking back at the good moments that Rj and IQ brought us. As you noted, us fans have created deep connections to these guys and its hard to see them moved on from so abruptly. They are both key reasons as to why this organization is where it is today and they had many great moments in the uniform. Anytime IQ stepped on the court was a true joy, and he is one of the most fun players to watch in the entire league. And with Rj, he had his fair share of incredible moments as well, like in the playoffs last year (where he impacted winning in a positive/meaningful way ;))). It would be nice to provide some “closure” on this front.
This all said, I am a fan of this move and have a lot of other thoughts that I will save for another newsletter!
Thank you Jonas! I will try to get that piece out this week before the moment has passed. Maybe even today. Great idea.
OG is such a perfect fit for the Knicks. I can’t wait to see it on the floor. I just wish Mitch could get back healthy this year - we would have one of the most imposing defenses in the league. I will always love RJ and IQ, but to me the writing was on the wall with them since the Donovan Mitchell trade talks. You can agree or disagree with the front office’s assessment, but it is what it is. Of course, we’re still in the position of waiting for the next move once again, but at least this version of the roster makes sense again. There’s a clear upgrade potential at SG (and/or possibly at center?)... but at least the pieces we have here now make sense together. Weird day. Thank you for helping to bring us back to respectability and for all the memories, IQ and RJ. 💙🧡
Man, you and me both on the "Mitch & OG together" front.
Wonderful piece, Jon. Thanks to the entire KFS team for all the great emergency content today!
The emotional aspect is so, so tough for me. Probably the toughest of any trade in recent memory. I’ve loved RJ since “Yo! I’m a Knick” and Quickley since he burst on to the scene. I have not experienced much winning in my time as a Knicks fan. RJ and IQ were parts of two of the most fun seasons I’ve seen. I couldn’t help but get attached to them and I would have killed for it to work out here and have them be part of the championship core
At the same time, I’m the same one who recently started advocating to upgrade the wing spot so we don’t waste Jalen and Julius’s primes. This trade accomplishes that and I’m excited to see OG on the team and what comes next. I think it’s good the front office is done waiting around. We have two All-NBA level guys to build around. Go for it!
But losing RJ and IQ like this stings
Thank you Chris! This is so well said and I felt it in my core. Who'd have known fandom could be such a tough job.
Well said
Great write up on a difficult topic.
For me, I saw the championship years where it was easy to root for a great team that was likable. Same for the near miss teams that broke their heart against the wall of the Bulls (and some others...😤).
And then there have been long wastelands of terrible and unlikeable players representing the Knicks. I waited for years for players who were gifted and likable as human beings. IQ met that standard in spades.
And so now I grieve for what might have been. I doubt I will be around for a real championship team since those seem to depend upon generational players and having that guy is so random. But maybe.
It is going to take a while to get over losing this player. I suppose I will since I have had to get over a lot worse than basketball over the years entering a seventh decade.
Thanks for helping me process.
I tried Peter, and I know how passionate you are about Quickley, and I do not blame you for a moment. My thought / hope is that this gets them closer to that fabled, elusive promised land, but reasonable minds can disagree. We shall see.
You did warn me for a couple of years. Thanks for your incredible insights and compassion. What you do here really is incredible.
I find it interesting that you write an article detailing the issues of RJ and he is gone in a couple of days. Seems like you did send it to Brunson. 😂
Peter, thanks so much for that. Truly.
And while I have heard that certain members of the org have read this newsletter in the past, I would never be so bold as to suggest it had any impact on this move!
They got a piece alot of teams in the East want and now can't have. Sixers and Pacers for sure.
Underrated component of this move
Not underrated by me!
I am not 90/10 or 50/50 for this trade. I am 100/0 in favor.
The Knicks needed more size and to reduce the logjam at SG (too many players for the minutes there). Giving up Barrett, who's been eviscerated here of late, should not be met with grief of any kind. Quickley would've been a FO decision--it was apparent he was going to be moved. Annunoby is a great fit and I'm trusting/hoping that Leon Rose will re-sign him.
So yes, I'm all in. If ultimately successful, it may someday somewhat be thought of as comparable to the Cazzie Russell (high-scoring sixth man) for Jerry Lucas (PF/center and a better roster fit).
As for any presumed trade for Donovan Mitchell, I'm a no. Reason: lack of defense/size at the backcourt for approx. 30 minutes a game. Witness previous Knick high-scoring/no-defense duos from the past: Haywood/McAdoo; Anthony/Stoudamire; Fournier/Walker. Frequent final scores like 133-127 does not make for a champioship-caliber team.
I'm with you - for as much as I understand *how* they could wind up losers in this trade, I don't see *ANY* way they could have passed it up given all of the factors at play. And FTM at least, I'm also a no on Mitchell, but I need to dwell on that some more.
Got Anunoby cheaper than I thought with my trades for RJ... let's go Knicks
I feel that this was more about IQ than RJ. The Knicks weren’t going to be able to pay IQ what he thought he deserved and keep him as a sixth man. He had to get starters minutes in order to justify a significant payday,and that wasn’t happening with Brunson as the lead guard. RJ will be a better version of himself, he’ll have more freedom to operate. Now we get OG and Precious both of whom can play small ball 5 if needed. Grimes should get more minutes too now that the FO cleared some of the logjam of guards. We still need a bonafide shooter, so let’s see if Fournier gets moved too.
I would've loved this trade if I knew another piece was coming in IQ wasn't part of it. I have to now retire my IQ statue to knick oblivion. everything you say analytically is correct Johnathan, but it still hurts. I really had hoped that Barrett after the summer with the Canadian team would make him worth every penny and it's just too much inconsistency as the IQ I can see him running for Toronto and scoring 25 to 30 points a night. On my wish list of Brunson and him together like Monroe and Fraser. I guess I have to live with the idea that it'll never happen. Happy new year.
I hear you and feel you Mike. I think IQ is going to thrive in Toronto. But I also don't think him and Brunson was ever tenable on a title team. Could be wrong about that. I wonder if we'll ever find out for sure.
Don't know if my original went through on this, but just in case. I just love this kid he brought it all onto the court with such spontaneity and creativity. Who knows if they would've been a good tandem, but again, my mindset is still historical with Frazier and Monroe, where everyone said they wouldn't be enough balls. Thank you for your wonderful work and wishing you and your family a happy healthy new year. Addition by subtraction should work especially if they aren't finished yet which I don't think they are. There is no way in nowhere that they don't sign Adanobe to extension. Just like Scott Boras wasn't talked to about an extension with soto before the trade.
My wife says thank you! And HNY to you and yours as well!
I don’t know how I feel about this deal, and I probably will not until they bring in a star-level player to replace Quickley’s ability to shoot, create and pass. And it won’t be easy. Of the the five players traded, Quickley has the highest upside and the best chance at becoming an all-star. Trading RJ on the other hand makes great sense. RJ just could not accept that he’s not a star, and could never learn to defer to Brunson or Randle.
OG is definitely a big upgrade in the front court. He’s a good shooter, 37% from 3 land and 40% when shooting corner threes. And obviously, he is a tremendous defender. But he cannot create his own shot and I hope he doesn’t decide he’s a superstar and gun away.
To me, this deal is incomplete. They now desperately need a creative scorer. Until then, during crunch time, Brunson will have five guys guarding him (an exaggeration but point made) and the Knicks will need to depend upon Donte or Grimes to relieve the pressure on Brunson. This is going to be an issue. Until a deal comes along for an efficient scorer, I think the Knicks have taken a step backwards.
Boy, I’d be throwing a party if they traded Grimes in this deal and not RJ.
I think it's VERY fair to mark this as an incomplete for right now. And I also think there's a good chance IQ winds up being the best player in the deal. But I'm also in favor. We'll see
It's clear that Leon read your newsletter on RJ from a few days ago and Masai didn't ;)
Ha. Well...IDK about that, but I can say from knowledge that they had their doubts about RJ on several fronts.
This raised an eyebrow for me. Off the court concerns about RJ? I feel like Thibs sort of hinted last season he didn’t think RJ was in the gym enough.
I'm...not at liberty to say what I'd really like to, but I can assure you there's some behind the scenes stuff that contributed to this trade.
Jon, I absolutely adore you & KFS & everything you've done here, but I feel like I have to say: Still talking about RJ's mythical upside not even a single day after writing the "Rowan Reckoning" article just feels crazy!
I guess that's sports. We believe in our guys and that they'll eventually reach the tantalizing upside they've shown us. But as your article last week stated:
- RJ is about to cross the 10,000 minute threshold, making him the 182nd player to cross that level. He's the 181st best player in terms of win shares over that time.
- RJ has the SAME WS/48 as FRANKIE SMOKES!!!
I've quoted the stat about Frankie Smokes to my friends all day when they've moaned & cried about losing RJ and the "upside". As desperately as I wanted RJ to be our savior, as much as I cheered when he hit that OT 3 against Boston, as proud as I was when we drafted him and he was so happy to be a Knick, he's just not that dude. He's more Evan Turner than Kawhi Leonard and that's a sad truth, but it is a truth. I wish him the best in Toronto & I hope being back on Maple soil helps him reach his upside. But it wasn't happening here.
As for IQ, we can absolutely debate the merits & potential upside that's there, but I also think we pretty much know who that dude is too. The league has had some incredible 6th men over the decades like Sweet Lou, JR, Jamal, etc., and the one thing they all have in common is that they bounced around to new teams every few years as that role is, simply, replaceable. IQ was my favorite Knick over the last few years, and it hurts to see him go -- but that was always his role.
I don't know if OG will help us reach our goals. But I do think I know, based on what we've seen over the last ~100 basketball games and your analysis along the way, that this team had reached its ceiling. It's time for something new, and as you said above we know have another piece that every team in the league would want on their team. Count me in.
Go Knicks & thank you Jon & team for the incredible work that is KFS.
Thanks for the thoughtful comment Nick! You know how I role: I always want to acknowledge all sides to any discussion topic even if I may not agree with them. Personally, I've been out on RJ for far longer than I've let on here. But at the same time, would it *shock* me if he put it all together at some point? Honestly no. In any case, HNY and LGK!
Great article Jon, and it was cathartic for me, as always. My brother, who is RJ's #1 fan, called me as soon as the news and the dejection in his voice was obvious. I had him on speaker and my wife thought something much more serious had happened. But that's fandom, because for us, it did. Still, I am comforted by the fact that Leon did RJ right by sending him home. He deserves that, for both his play and for the person that he is. I will follow his career, and Quick's closely as they made our team a team. I have to think giving Quick up in the deal was difficult, but this also tells me more is coming. And when it does, and when we win a championship, then we will know for certain it was the right move. But, much like letting go the girl you love deeply, even though it hurts and there may be dark days ahead, you're certain you'll find your soul mate because of it. As a fan, that's how I feel about the deal.
Thanks so much Brian, and please give your brother my best. It takes a real one to have stuck with RJ through thick and thin, and I feel for his biggest supporters probably more than Quick's tbh, because at least IQ has made it easy on his biggest fans.
Obviously what happens on the floor will decide whether this trade is a success or a failure, but in this moment, I don’t see how this is anything but a pretty significant W. We got a guy who, according to everything I read, was coveted league-wide, 1.5 additional rotation pieces (hopefully Deuce gets first crack over Flynn), and our roster is suddenly much more versatile and dynamic. We can go big or small; we can finally play 5-out; we traded two guys who need the ball and didn’t truly complement Brunson/Randle skill-wise and brought back a 26-year-old All-Defender who does (plus Precious, who I think is much more than a throw-in) -- I’m sad to see our guys go - I truly liked both of them - but I’m really f***ing excited to see how this comes together over the next twenty-plus games.
(I didn’t even mention that the only pick we gave up was a second!! That’s insane)
Couldn't have said it better myself Mike.