I think KP would be a very good fit in terms of juicing the offense. But it’d be a downgrade on D... would be tough to see Thibs succeeding with KP at the 5. It would be odd to have him back, but I think I’d be in favor.
Any time I think of where the Knicks will turn this summer KP and KAT are two names I keep circling back to. The other main option would seem to be upgrading RJ to a more efficient wing, though finding an actual move to do that feels harder.
Hey Jon... Do you think KP can play the 4? Joking, joking!! Nice food for thought... Washington is a sinking organization that is stuck with Bradley Beal, who would be willing to take on that contract? I believe he has a no-trade as well?
I keep reminding myself that this summer is more about “not making the wrong more” compared to “making the right move or the big move”.
The question of whether to bring back KP is fascinating. Putting aside the 'how' of getting him to New York, the 'why' would represent the biggest pivot of the Leon Rose era. Bringing KP to NY would mean Mitch is almost certainly gone - Mitch and KP are not going to be backups and their styles are too dissimilar. I think Thibs wants his centers to be plug-and-play, and he does not want his backup center to require a wholly different type of offense. Hartenstein didn't really shoot last season, but he did show he had the ability for it in LA. And maybe Sims is young enough that he can also develop a passable outside shot as the third center?
KP (and Hartenstein?) would operate as a stretch five, allowing more driving lanes for Brunson, Randle, and RJ. But it would come at the expense of elite offensive rebounding. Does having five capable shooters on the floor lead to higher FG% at the rim and improved 3PT% enough to offset that they'll likely take far fewer shots. Or do teams play drop when KP is a PNR screener because his size allows him to get off any 3PT he wants to, so why bother when you can still clog the paint and make life tough for drivers?
Defensively, KP is not nearly as good of a defensive anchor or rebounder as Mitch, despite his ability to block shots. Can the Knicks have a top-10 quality defense if KP is at center every night? And even if the Knicks can solve for these new problems, can KP stay healthy enough to justify these big changes? Or are the Knicks back at square one when KP tears his meniscus in Game 12, or is dealing with chronic knee soreness through March and April (and hopefully May)?
I like KP as a stretch 5, but as noted it depends on the cost in dollars $40 million, no thanks) and picks and players-Obi, Washington’s pick and salary filler, I am in. Much more, I am out.
It will be interesting to see if players like KP get anything close to their max with the new CBA, particularly when you add his injury history. There is always one desperate and foolish team out there, but it is not that long ago that Dallas was essentially salary dumping him.
With the new labor agreement, teams will be rewarded for staying at or near the cap and punished if teams spend, spend, spend.
I think KP would be a major mistake if the Knicks added him to their roster. First of all, $40m year is crazy for a guy who has not really won anywhere and he is injury-prone. Unfortunately for KP, guys with his height and body build have had significant issues through their careers, I don't want the Knicks paying a guy $40m a year who has played an average of 45 games per season.
I prefer KP as the villain. Signing or sign and trading for him seems like a desperate move Isiah Thomas would make. I do not want to bet on that body holding up over even a 3 or 4 year contract. Stay away.
kp, so many mixed memories. brunson may have some insight into the new kp. i hope he is consulted. it does seem that kp is better since he left dallas so maybe there is more there than even brunson knows. i still think our new star can tell us alot.
When KP started rolling for the Knicks. My interest in the Knicks started to resurge to watching every single game again. We can all say we hated the attitude and the way he left but my only question is if he can't shoot threes like he used to how much does he really help. I like all the comments that were just made but that's my sticking point. My other sticking point is separating Julius and RJ because they both need to drive to the basket to be totally effective. We need a shooter desperately but I'd like an outside shooter. I also always find that when I rehire in ex-employee it never works.
I really think the org needs to give RJ and Julius the optimum environment for success, at least for a season, and that means clearing the paint from Mitch and adding shooting.
As much as I [sports-] hated KP and felt completely betrayed by his behaviour I do think he fits that role (other option might be Myles Turner). Old welcome hi, back.
Our roster has too many constraints and lacks flexibility and creativity on O. It’s just dumb that 2 of our best players are not setup to be their best selves. Not even mentioning that Brunson/KP PnRs will be very hard to stop.
I'd lean no on a KP reunion. He's a good player who would obviously open things up for the Knicks in certain aspects of the game but I don't think he brings them anywhere closer to their goals.
I’d be happy if the Knicks chose to transition from Mitch to a more dynamic offensive center, but I struggle to see how this would work on two fronts:
1. What is a reasonable trade that the Wizards would accept? I know they could lose him for nothing so their leverage isn’t great, but it’s not like they’re going to accept Mitch, Fournier, their pick, and scraps. How many picks are we talking? Just one more beyond their own? And what about players - is Obi enough to move that needle? Is hometown IQ a deal-breaker? And then - if the deal ends up looking something like Mitch, IQ, multiple firsts, and filler, are we doing that?
2. If both RJ and Randle stay, are we at all concerned about how the sacrifice of touches / shots might affect one or both of them? One underrated benefit of Mitch is that his lack of touches (prior to grabbing OReb) allows those guys to get more, and both are better with more offensive involvement. We’ve seen Randle pout and loaf when he’s not a focal point, and we’ve seen RJ struggle mightily when relegated to role player. So while I’d love to upgrade to a center that can provide some spacing, polish, and touch on offense, I wonder if KP is too far to the other extreme bc of the touches his skill set would demand.
I truly don’t see how we go into next year with both RJ and Randle unless we’re content with Donte DiVincenzo being our most meaningful change.
I don't think the Knicks spacing is that bad on paper. It worse in practice then on paper b/c we always play a traditional 5, never play our wings at 4 if Obi and Randle are healthy, play pretty slow, limit ball movement to max ball control, and are built around two isolation heavy players that work very methodically. There are positives that come from some of the decisions that hurt spacing, and we may not want to change, but I think it is important to not become too reductive about issues you want to address. KP is an option, but 10 mins of Obi/ Randle could help as could I-Hart as a DHO hub, maybe Zach Collins could be an option. Not saying a big move shouldn't be considered but there are different ways to address spacing including internal adjustments.
Are you going to do a Raptors Team Breakdown as they might be the most likely team to have the most turnover this season with Pascal OG FVV and Gary Trent all seemingly available. Also in a hypothetical and Ideal world if we did a 1 for 1 Pascal for Randle swap with everyone on the roster remaining do you think the Knicks would've fared better this year? I also like the idea of a KP reunion but dont like the idea of KP and Randle. If KP was your 5 what player would be your ideal 4? (Feel like Pascal works)
I think Jeremy convinced me that the Knicks’ primary move this summer is RJ + Fournier + protected pick(s) for Lavine. (Can we somehow shoehorn Rose in the trade to ensure we get Caruso back from Chicago?) Is a sign-and-trade for KP still viable financially as a secondary move following a Lavine trade? With Brunson’s efficiency, Lavine’s efficiency and KP’s efficiency I’d be much more tolerant of Randle’s inefficiency. It also means we could trade one-dimensional Mitch to accrue future draft capital or for a ‘23 draft pick and acquire a more modern center like Duke’s Dereck Lively who could eventually replace KP...
I think KP would be a very good fit in terms of juicing the offense. But it’d be a downgrade on D... would be tough to see Thibs succeeding with KP at the 5. It would be odd to have him back, but I think I’d be in favor.
Any time I think of where the Knicks will turn this summer KP and KAT are two names I keep circling back to. The other main option would seem to be upgrading RJ to a more efficient wing, though finding an actual move to do that feels harder.
Hey Jon... Do you think KP can play the 4? Joking, joking!! Nice food for thought... Washington is a sinking organization that is stuck with Bradley Beal, who would be willing to take on that contract? I believe he has a no-trade as well?
I keep reminding myself that this summer is more about “not making the wrong more” compared to “making the right move or the big move”.
Knowing you, the stats are right, and I think a white body like him could do wonders if he can run down the court enough to keep tibbs happy
I'm game. I thought his stats were worse on the threes.
The question of whether to bring back KP is fascinating. Putting aside the 'how' of getting him to New York, the 'why' would represent the biggest pivot of the Leon Rose era. Bringing KP to NY would mean Mitch is almost certainly gone - Mitch and KP are not going to be backups and their styles are too dissimilar. I think Thibs wants his centers to be plug-and-play, and he does not want his backup center to require a wholly different type of offense. Hartenstein didn't really shoot last season, but he did show he had the ability for it in LA. And maybe Sims is young enough that he can also develop a passable outside shot as the third center?
KP (and Hartenstein?) would operate as a stretch five, allowing more driving lanes for Brunson, Randle, and RJ. But it would come at the expense of elite offensive rebounding. Does having five capable shooters on the floor lead to higher FG% at the rim and improved 3PT% enough to offset that they'll likely take far fewer shots. Or do teams play drop when KP is a PNR screener because his size allows him to get off any 3PT he wants to, so why bother when you can still clog the paint and make life tough for drivers?
Defensively, KP is not nearly as good of a defensive anchor or rebounder as Mitch, despite his ability to block shots. Can the Knicks have a top-10 quality defense if KP is at center every night? And even if the Knicks can solve for these new problems, can KP stay healthy enough to justify these big changes? Or are the Knicks back at square one when KP tears his meniscus in Game 12, or is dealing with chronic knee soreness through March and April (and hopefully May)?
I like KP as a stretch 5, but as noted it depends on the cost in dollars $40 million, no thanks) and picks and players-Obi, Washington’s pick and salary filler, I am in. Much more, I am out.
It will be interesting to see if players like KP get anything close to their max with the new CBA, particularly when you add his injury history. There is always one desperate and foolish team out there, but it is not that long ago that Dallas was essentially salary dumping him.
With the new labor agreement, teams will be rewarded for staying at or near the cap and punished if teams spend, spend, spend.
I think KP would be a major mistake if the Knicks added him to their roster. First of all, $40m year is crazy for a guy who has not really won anywhere and he is injury-prone. Unfortunately for KP, guys with his height and body build have had significant issues through their careers, I don't want the Knicks paying a guy $40m a year who has played an average of 45 games per season.
I prefer KP as the villain. Signing or sign and trading for him seems like a desperate move Isiah Thomas would make. I do not want to bet on that body holding up over even a 3 or 4 year contract. Stay away.
kp, so many mixed memories. brunson may have some insight into the new kp. i hope he is consulted. it does seem that kp is better since he left dallas so maybe there is more there than even brunson knows. i still think our new star can tell us alot.
When KP started rolling for the Knicks. My interest in the Knicks started to resurge to watching every single game again. We can all say we hated the attitude and the way he left but my only question is if he can't shoot threes like he used to how much does he really help. I like all the comments that were just made but that's my sticking point. My other sticking point is separating Julius and RJ because they both need to drive to the basket to be totally effective. We need a shooter desperately but I'd like an outside shooter. I also always find that when I rehire in ex-employee it never works.
I really think the org needs to give RJ and Julius the optimum environment for success, at least for a season, and that means clearing the paint from Mitch and adding shooting.
As much as I [sports-] hated KP and felt completely betrayed by his behaviour I do think he fits that role (other option might be Myles Turner). Old welcome hi, back.
Our roster has too many constraints and lacks flexibility and creativity on O. It’s just dumb that 2 of our best players are not setup to be their best selves. Not even mentioning that Brunson/KP PnRs will be very hard to stop.
I'd lean no on a KP reunion. He's a good player who would obviously open things up for the Knicks in certain aspects of the game but I don't think he brings them anywhere closer to their goals.
I’d be happy if the Knicks chose to transition from Mitch to a more dynamic offensive center, but I struggle to see how this would work on two fronts:
1. What is a reasonable trade that the Wizards would accept? I know they could lose him for nothing so their leverage isn’t great, but it’s not like they’re going to accept Mitch, Fournier, their pick, and scraps. How many picks are we talking? Just one more beyond their own? And what about players - is Obi enough to move that needle? Is hometown IQ a deal-breaker? And then - if the deal ends up looking something like Mitch, IQ, multiple firsts, and filler, are we doing that?
2. If both RJ and Randle stay, are we at all concerned about how the sacrifice of touches / shots might affect one or both of them? One underrated benefit of Mitch is that his lack of touches (prior to grabbing OReb) allows those guys to get more, and both are better with more offensive involvement. We’ve seen Randle pout and loaf when he’s not a focal point, and we’ve seen RJ struggle mightily when relegated to role player. So while I’d love to upgrade to a center that can provide some spacing, polish, and touch on offense, I wonder if KP is too far to the other extreme bc of the touches his skill set would demand.
I truly don’t see how we go into next year with both RJ and Randle unless we’re content with Donte DiVincenzo being our most meaningful change.
I don't think the Knicks spacing is that bad on paper. It worse in practice then on paper b/c we always play a traditional 5, never play our wings at 4 if Obi and Randle are healthy, play pretty slow, limit ball movement to max ball control, and are built around two isolation heavy players that work very methodically. There are positives that come from some of the decisions that hurt spacing, and we may not want to change, but I think it is important to not become too reductive about issues you want to address. KP is an option, but 10 mins of Obi/ Randle could help as could I-Hart as a DHO hub, maybe Zach Collins could be an option. Not saying a big move shouldn't be considered but there are different ways to address spacing including internal adjustments.
Are you going to do a Raptors Team Breakdown as they might be the most likely team to have the most turnover this season with Pascal OG FVV and Gary Trent all seemingly available. Also in a hypothetical and Ideal world if we did a 1 for 1 Pascal for Randle swap with everyone on the roster remaining do you think the Knicks would've fared better this year? I also like the idea of a KP reunion but dont like the idea of KP and Randle. If KP was your 5 what player would be your ideal 4? (Feel like Pascal works)
I think Jeremy convinced me that the Knicks’ primary move this summer is RJ + Fournier + protected pick(s) for Lavine. (Can we somehow shoehorn Rose in the trade to ensure we get Caruso back from Chicago?) Is a sign-and-trade for KP still viable financially as a secondary move following a Lavine trade? With Brunson’s efficiency, Lavine’s efficiency and KP’s efficiency I’d be much more tolerant of Randle’s inefficiency. It also means we could trade one-dimensional Mitch to accrue future draft capital or for a ‘23 draft pick and acquire a more modern center like Duke’s Dereck Lively who could eventually replace KP...