Once again you are spot on! Thank you for backing up what I see with the eye test. True confession I've never been a Randle fan even watching him as a Laker. I've always felt he was a good role player or a solid 3 on a good team. I was not happy when he was signed by the Knicks but two seasons ago I was pleasantly surprised that he developed an outside shot which obviously elevated his game and my opinion of his game. Like many I bought his rhetoric that he watched film and recognized his weaknesses and he was a changed player. That year he still had mental lapses but the good far out weighed the bad. Last year he totally reverted back to his past play and it was distressing to realize Knicks had four more years of this guy. This year he looked like he was trying to play the right way but with his success he further lapsed into his hero ball play on offense and the indifferent defense much too often to be on the court that long in games. Thibs contributes to the BS with his minutes distribution. It's obvious that Thibs must adjust his thinking to the talent and the chemistry of the team. Cam is the most athletic and complete Wing who at 6'8' with long arms needs to play more to help with the defense. Cam is just raw and needed to stay at Duke another year to further harness his offense. It's difficult for players like him to mentally adjust lto understanding his strengths, weaknesses and earn in the Pros what he needed to learn at the lower levels. The FO needs to put the brakes on any Cam trade and focus on moving Evan. Thibs needs to cut back Randle's minutes and sit down with him privately and go over the video pointing out his defensive lapses and poor offensive decisions because the Knicks will likely not get value for him right now and he could contribute to a better team.
You're welcome ML! I think he's a sub on a good team. Sadly he doesn't view himself in anything close to that light. Completely agree on the invest in Cam / move or bench Evan philosophy. I think Evan might be out of the rotation tonight.
I hear you about the defense vs Boston and agree to a certain extent about effort and execution, etc. However, the Celtics and Knicks both had great shooting games. Both shot the ball better than they normally do. The Celtics had 88 FGA and 12 FTA. They took 51 3's and made 27. Celtics shot 53/53/100. The Knicks had 90 FGA and 16 FTA They took 27 3's and made 11. Knicks shot 51/41/94. Celtics had 12 turnovers and Knicks had 13 turnovers. We beat the Celtics on the boards and still lost the game by 15 points.
I think the biggest factor was difference in coaching philosophy. See athletic article Joe Mazzula likes math https://theathletic.com/3746993/2022/10/31/math-favors-celtics-joe-mazzulla/ We literally just beat the 76ers the previous day playing a small ball lineup. Thibs says you win or you learn. It would be nice if we could win and learn. Proving that we won and didn't learn, Thibs played two traditional centers 41 minutes and prioritized protecting the rim in a game where the Celtics played 48 minutes without a traditional center and were focused on playing a 5 out offense / shooting threes. Hart played 38 minutes and didn't take a 3. Obi was our leading 3 point shooter going into the game, had a fantastic game against Philly and he only got 15 minutes where he was 1/5 from 3.
Brunson, RJ and Randle had good nights when Mitch was not in the middle clogging up the paint. I don't think this is at all surprising. I hope Thibs uses the time while Mitch is out to allocate the center / PF minutes to Obi, Hart, and Randle so that Obi gets at 30 minutes / game so (a) we can see what we have with the kid and (b) so we can try to run the type of small ball offense / defense that teams that win in the playoffs / compete for championships play.
i noticed the lack of effort from him as well. It happens on the offensive end too, when a teammates shot goes up and he is not near the rim, he just stands there. He could head to the rim to fight for the rebound, or head back to get in a good defensive position, but no, he just watches. he has really bad habits and always has, and Thibs not holding him accountable is rubbing off on rj whose motor is not that same as it was a few years ago (maybe others too). Sorry, but Ju is not a "dog" as he likes to think himself to be. At his best, he slightly overcomes his lack of motor with talent (rebounding and scoring). at his average and worst level, he is a player that brings down the whole team. I wonder why Thibs puts up with it??????
Let’s face facts, best athletes not always best player.
This is a mediocre team at best. Leon Rose has failed us again. Cleveland outflanked him. The Mitchell deal was his for the taking. He thought like an agent, not a GM. Mitchell was a game changer, he had 6 ones in the bank, last years pick in gleague.
Now Mitch Robinson, yes athletic, but rarely a double double and is frequently injured . I’d take a Sabonis a Vucevik any day.
They passed on Derozen not athletic?
I hate when reporters don’t like a player, he can’t play D. Mitchell destroyed Reddish, he’s athletic but erratic 4points in 37 minutes? Plus team 0-2 with him as starter.
Fournier is not responsible for no D against the three in Boston, he’s nest 3 point shooter on team. Maybe just maybe it’s not any one player. Thins defensive schemes my be outdated. Drive in, Knicks double, pitch out to open three. Easy to see teams far more open on threes then Knicks. Problems with many GM’s. Reporter, they never played the game.
Fournier has been fall guy from beginning, thibs gives him little respect. He’s proven in all National tournaments he can play, took France to #2 in world. Not a great player, but only pure shooter on team.
Leon Rose is architect, what ever happened to Perry, is he still our GM? This team is flawed, QUENTON Grimes not the answer, this is not summer league. If we lost Mitchell because they wouldn’t trade him, well we are in for a nothingbwasted season.
Fantastic as usual - so I’d like to thank you (thank?), because now when I watch I count in my head the seconds Randle has the ball in his hands without doing anything, so a new level of frustration has been added to my game watching. 😊 Also, the videos with the explanations are great in that when I watch the game I could be like WTF is Cam doing, but then see your breakdown and it shows he’s trying to recover to his man because someone else didn’t do what THEY were supposed to be doing, clears things up.
Lastly, in the worst possible basketball news I have heard, there appear to be rumblings about the Lakers trading AD. Of course the Knicks came up and they have the Knicks basically sending everything and then some to LA for AD to make up for the DM miss. In the worst package I’ve heard it has the NYK sending Mitch, Randle, and like 5 1st round picks (didn’t specify their own or not, so I guess this effects it). As much as I’d like to get rid of Randle, this is not the way I’d like to see it done. And to clarify, ‘heard’ means podcasts and internet rumors 😏.
Thanks Jon. Randle got a lot of undue praise to start the season. The shot dropped against Boston. He was an offensive force and a clear positive overall but as usual his effort away from the spot light of the ball was bad (on both sides). Great job
For the sanctity of your family, I strongly advise you to resist reviewing post game Knicks tape for Randle errors or lack of effort. It will not end well.
Only push back is the stars for Cam. The guy played 37 mins and scored 4 points. I admit I noticed him on D. When you stand out on D and not for sucking it means you are doing something right. Cam was active and disruptive. I think his bar right now might be as low as Randle’s was to start the season though. Yeah he has a good +/-. he also doesn't share the court with the guy getting blamed for everything in Evan 😀
Once again you are spot on! Thank you for backing up what I see with the eye test. True confession I've never been a Randle fan even watching him as a Laker. I've always felt he was a good role player or a solid 3 on a good team. I was not happy when he was signed by the Knicks but two seasons ago I was pleasantly surprised that he developed an outside shot which obviously elevated his game and my opinion of his game. Like many I bought his rhetoric that he watched film and recognized his weaknesses and he was a changed player. That year he still had mental lapses but the good far out weighed the bad. Last year he totally reverted back to his past play and it was distressing to realize Knicks had four more years of this guy. This year he looked like he was trying to play the right way but with his success he further lapsed into his hero ball play on offense and the indifferent defense much too often to be on the court that long in games. Thibs contributes to the BS with his minutes distribution. It's obvious that Thibs must adjust his thinking to the talent and the chemistry of the team. Cam is the most athletic and complete Wing who at 6'8' with long arms needs to play more to help with the defense. Cam is just raw and needed to stay at Duke another year to further harness his offense. It's difficult for players like him to mentally adjust lto understanding his strengths, weaknesses and earn in the Pros what he needed to learn at the lower levels. The FO needs to put the brakes on any Cam trade and focus on moving Evan. Thibs needs to cut back Randle's minutes and sit down with him privately and go over the video pointing out his defensive lapses and poor offensive decisions because the Knicks will likely not get value for him right now and he could contribute to a better team.
You're welcome ML! I think he's a sub on a good team. Sadly he doesn't view himself in anything close to that light. Completely agree on the invest in Cam / move or bench Evan philosophy. I think Evan might be out of the rotation tonight.
I hear you about the defense vs Boston and agree to a certain extent about effort and execution, etc. However, the Celtics and Knicks both had great shooting games. Both shot the ball better than they normally do. The Celtics had 88 FGA and 12 FTA. They took 51 3's and made 27. Celtics shot 53/53/100. The Knicks had 90 FGA and 16 FTA They took 27 3's and made 11. Knicks shot 51/41/94. Celtics had 12 turnovers and Knicks had 13 turnovers. We beat the Celtics on the boards and still lost the game by 15 points.
I think the biggest factor was difference in coaching philosophy. See athletic article Joe Mazzula likes math https://theathletic.com/3746993/2022/10/31/math-favors-celtics-joe-mazzulla/ We literally just beat the 76ers the previous day playing a small ball lineup. Thibs says you win or you learn. It would be nice if we could win and learn. Proving that we won and didn't learn, Thibs played two traditional centers 41 minutes and prioritized protecting the rim in a game where the Celtics played 48 minutes without a traditional center and were focused on playing a 5 out offense / shooting threes. Hart played 38 minutes and didn't take a 3. Obi was our leading 3 point shooter going into the game, had a fantastic game against Philly and he only got 15 minutes where he was 1/5 from 3.
Brunson, RJ and Randle had good nights when Mitch was not in the middle clogging up the paint. I don't think this is at all surprising. I hope Thibs uses the time while Mitch is out to allocate the center / PF minutes to Obi, Hart, and Randle so that Obi gets at 30 minutes / game so (a) we can see what we have with the kid and (b) so we can try to run the type of small ball offense / defense that teams that win in the playoffs / compete for championships play.
i noticed the lack of effort from him as well. It happens on the offensive end too, when a teammates shot goes up and he is not near the rim, he just stands there. He could head to the rim to fight for the rebound, or head back to get in a good defensive position, but no, he just watches. he has really bad habits and always has, and Thibs not holding him accountable is rubbing off on rj whose motor is not that same as it was a few years ago (maybe others too). Sorry, but Ju is not a "dog" as he likes to think himself to be. At his best, he slightly overcomes his lack of motor with talent (rebounding and scoring). at his average and worst level, he is a player that brings down the whole team. I wonder why Thibs puts up with it??????
Ju is a puppy at best :)
Let’s face facts, best athletes not always best player.
This is a mediocre team at best. Leon Rose has failed us again. Cleveland outflanked him. The Mitchell deal was his for the taking. He thought like an agent, not a GM. Mitchell was a game changer, he had 6 ones in the bank, last years pick in gleague.
Now Mitch Robinson, yes athletic, but rarely a double double and is frequently injured . I’d take a Sabonis a Vucevik any day.
They passed on Derozen not athletic?
I hate when reporters don’t like a player, he can’t play D. Mitchell destroyed Reddish, he’s athletic but erratic 4points in 37 minutes? Plus team 0-2 with him as starter.
Fournier is not responsible for no D against the three in Boston, he’s nest 3 point shooter on team. Maybe just maybe it’s not any one player. Thins defensive schemes my be outdated. Drive in, Knicks double, pitch out to open three. Easy to see teams far more open on threes then Knicks. Problems with many GM’s. Reporter, they never played the game.
Fournier has been fall guy from beginning, thibs gives him little respect. He’s proven in all National tournaments he can play, took France to #2 in world. Not a great player, but only pure shooter on team.
Leon Rose is architect, what ever happened to Perry, is he still our GM? This team is flawed, QUENTON Grimes not the answer, this is not summer league. If we lost Mitchell because they wouldn’t trade him, well we are in for a nothingbwasted season.
Fire Rose, replace Thibs, start Obi
Fantastic as usual - so I’d like to thank you (thank?), because now when I watch I count in my head the seconds Randle has the ball in his hands without doing anything, so a new level of frustration has been added to my game watching. 😊 Also, the videos with the explanations are great in that when I watch the game I could be like WTF is Cam doing, but then see your breakdown and it shows he’s trying to recover to his man because someone else didn’t do what THEY were supposed to be doing, clears things up.
Lastly, in the worst possible basketball news I have heard, there appear to be rumblings about the Lakers trading AD. Of course the Knicks came up and they have the Knicks basically sending everything and then some to LA for AD to make up for the DM miss. In the worst package I’ve heard it has the NYK sending Mitch, Randle, and like 5 1st round picks (didn’t specify their own or not, so I guess this effects it). As much as I’d like to get rid of Randle, this is not the way I’d like to see it done. And to clarify, ‘heard’ means podcasts and internet rumors 😏.
Great article. Depressing though that you gave me another reason to hate seeing Randle on the floor. 😉
Thanks Jon. Randle got a lot of undue praise to start the season. The shot dropped against Boston. He was an offensive force and a clear positive overall but as usual his effort away from the spot light of the ball was bad (on both sides). Great job
For the sanctity of your family, I strongly advise you to resist reviewing post game Knicks tape for Randle errors or lack of effort. It will not end well.
I appreciate your concern for my mental and emotional wellbeing!
I gotchu.
“ I’m probably hard on the kid. What can I say.”
You could say why you hate RJ Barrett, Jon
I wish I could insert the crying laughing emoji on here :) well played sir
Only push back is the stars for Cam. The guy played 37 mins and scored 4 points. I admit I noticed him on D. When you stand out on D and not for sucking it means you are doing something right. Cam was active and disruptive. I think his bar right now might be as low as Randle’s was to start the season though. Yeah he has a good +/-. he also doesn't share the court with the guy getting blamed for everything in Evan 😀
Fair...I was just very partial to anyone who played defense in that game.